Newt Gingrich’s campaign could survive his ex-wife Marianne’s interview on ABC but I don’t see how. If reports are accurate Newt asked for an open marriage while speaking publicly about family values around the country. This can’t be tidied up and re-packaged as a human failing. Not in the GOP. Not in the post Reagan era. I suspect if Newt doesn’t take the hint and fade away by next week at the latest things will get worse for him…some how, some way. Clips from 1999 of Newt railing about the lack of moral character in national leaders must abound.
Clinton survived Flowers because:
A. He’s an astoundingly skilled politician. He’s probably the most naturally talented politician of our lifetimes.
B. Flowers was not an ex-wife.
C. Social media had not erupted on to the scene yet.
D. He’s a Democrat. Democrats are hypocrites on some issues. They don’t usually intone about family values while inviting a mistress into their marriages. I’m sure plenty stray. They don’t generally harangue everyone else while doing it.
Gingrich has none of these factors going for him. Gingrich has few outs here. He must win or come within a whisker of winning in South Carolina. The GOP mind baffles me. But one can hardly imagine Republican woman moving toward Gingrich at the last-minute now. If Gingrich wins in South Carolina it will become legendary…and stain the GOP in that state forever.
He must perform a political miracle at the debate tonight. Romney would be wise to avoid the scandal. There is no reason whatsoever for him to go near it. On the other hand, Santorum has nothing to lose by talking about “family values” and his “solid marriage” when answering any old question that comes up. Should we bomb Iran, Senator Santorum? Well, my wife of twenty years and I don’t like war but….Newt’s best bet is – at long last – to try to appear gallant toward his 2nd ex-wife. But the reality of his behaviour is still nauseating. It won’t go away in 36 hours.
Further, surrogates will have to trash his ex-wife. This is already happening – though there is no evidence he’s behind it. Marianne is “bitter” is what we’re already hearing. One can only think - Well, who wouldn’t be? Any attempt to trash Marianne Gingrich probably only makes matters worse for Newt. Cheating is one thing. Even the most judgemental conservatives understand marriages are rocky. Asking for an open marriage? It’s political cyanide in a closed Republican primary. Probably in any primary.
The Marianne revelations come close to making Gingrich radioactive. Even the most die-hard Gingrich Republicans must know he’d be toast against Obama in a general election.
I’ll add that past the horserace aspects of this scandal I’m personally happy to see Gingrich virtually drawn and quartered. The man is a class A hypocrite. He brutalized the nation with the asinine impeachment of a President, wiping his ass with the Constitution along the way. I have no sympathy for the man.
I’m intentionally not looking for clips of Newt talking about marriage equality because I don’t need the anger it would cause.
John, your reaction to Newt is what Team Obama is working for, I know you are aware of how they ‘disgrace and disapper’ all comers long before an election. Don’t fall for it..you’re too smart for that.
I equally dislike Newt for his hideous treatment of Clinton, but if I thought he could save us from four more years of the corrupt Wizard of Oz, I would support him.. As it happens, I think he is a loose cannon and not presidential..Wait ’til they get through with Romney, a businessman who actually made money, the horror ! Mother Teresa couldn’t survive the O machine, thoughtful voters will have to overlook it.
A choice between O and Newt is no choice at all. Both disgust me. I can only imagine their debates:
Newt: I was instrumental in the impeachment of Bill Clinton.
Obama: Well, I prevented Hillary from becoming president at all.
Newt: Oh yeah? Well, my mother called Hillary a bitch before you did.
I will not cast a vote for either.
Obama’s team would walk through fire bare foot, and repeat it, to run against Newt. I want some of whatever you’re smoking. On second thought, no I don’t, it’s just too weird.
SophieCT said: “A choice between O and Newt is no choice at all. Both disgust me.”
My sentiments exactly. I so strongly wish a NONE OF THE ABOVE choice could be put on the ballot and tallied as a barometer for the discontent with the current system.
“Obama’s team would walk through fire bare foot, and repeat it, to run against Newt”
Ain’t that the truth.
Sophie, I don’t think Obama had much to do with this story frankly. There is no motive for Obi to bury Newt now far as I can tell. If Newt became the nominee then you get Marianne to talk in October. Newt as the GOP nominee would be a gift from the gods to Obama. There is every motive for Mittens or Santorum to try to bring Gingrich down now. Or the GOP insiders who loath the man. There are many. Everyone who has ever worked for him seems to hate him. Everyone gets that independents are the deciders in a general election. Even more than that independent women. GOP insiders get that Gingrich loses them and Romney doesn’t right out the gate. They want Gingrich gone. Just like they wanted Cain gone. Bachmann and Perry took care of the matter on their own.
As for what Barry and Co. will do to Romney. I agree. However, it’s becoming clearer to me that in all likelihood Romney will be just as brutal to Obama. The business establishment wants Romney to be President. They have dough. I expect we’ll see them spend it. At this point it would surprise me if Mittens rolls like Kerry or McCain. But the 1st order of business is getting rid of Newt. We shall see. There could be a blow back from the Right against the “liberal media” on this story. Actually I think Drudges’ biased headlines often tell the insider GOP story. In this case he’s not been kind to Newt.
Sophie, I dislike Obama as much as you do. But, really, Newt needs to be gone, period.
John….You’re angle on Newt and the GOP vs. Dem infidelity is spot on. I don’t give damn who has sex with who, where, when or how, as long as all of the parties are adult and consenting. But what I’ll never accept are pompous do gooders, who want to preach to everyone else about the sanctity of 1 man, 1 woman marriage and that heterosexual marriage needs to be protected from L/G’s, while they’re wrangling behind closed doors for whatever feels good sex. It’s straight up hypocrisy!
Hypocrisy in politicians ? I’m shocked, I tell you shocked !
It boggles the mind. Next thing you know they’ll be lying to us.
Okay… Newt is a scumbag…but he fucking hit it out of the park to open the debate tonight.
http://www.cnn.com/2012/01/19/politics/gop-debate/index.html
please don’t think this means I support any of his self righteousness. He’s either the biggest liar in a century or utterly unconscious. However, it is nice to see some one attack the media for protecting Obama. And I do love the game of politics.
This is the only clip from the debate that is currently playing on the news radio stations I’ve heard tonight. And of course, I was in the car thinking about the hypocrisy of Gingrich and supporting his statements about the standards of the media. what a year this is.
I think the liar label is more accurate, John.
I think he scored big with the audience in the arena, but I don’t think that turd floats with most folks. He basically called his ex-wife a liar and offered up his friends and his daughters by his first wife to back him up. If you’ve ever been married or even in a committed relationship you know that your friends and your children don’t know what you say to your spouse/partner behind closed doors.
He’s been bitch slapping the media at every event because that scores big with the GOP crowd and he knows how to work that crowd for all it’s worth. They think the only media outlet in the nation worth watching is FOX and Newt even roasted Juan Williams for his question concerning Newts offer to go to the NAACP and tell them that they should “demand paychecks, not be satisfied with food stamps” (as if that’s what the NAACP does) I know folks don’t want to hear “race card” because of what happened to Hillary and many of us who supported Hillary in 2008, but when Newt issued that proclaimation I heard the dog whistle loud and clear and I’m a State away from SC. But that line and the defense of that line got Newt a standing O and the next day a woman at another event thanked Newt for “Putting Juan Williams in his place” I’m not sure where she thinks his place is, but that comment also got a standing ovation.
I
What I find fascinating is that apparently, if you can believe conservative talk radio, Marianne’s claims have been on the record for a long time and this is rehashed. If this REALLY has been out there for a while then what has Gingrich been smoking that made him think he could win? There is a game afoot here, just not sure what it is.
The King and his Castle, both utterly hollow fakes.
http://www.buzzfeed.com/jpmoore/13-photos-of-barack-obama-at-disney-that-will-prob
Are those pics photoshopped or was O seriously demented enough to go to Disneyland/Fantasyland to give a speech? I have to think the former. Anyone know?
Yep, O is demented enough to make an election year speech at the entrance to FantasyLand. Un-effin’-believable!
You gotta love the irony, along with the blatant hypocrisy involved, in finding a reason to “prop up” Newt simply because of the loathing for Obama.
We are talking about a man who has absolutely no moral compass and such a lack of integrity he was ousted from the speakership role as a result.
The same man who was the driving force about impeaching a sitting president yet at the same time was sharing his bed with a congressional aide as his second wife was left to cope alone with a diagnosis for multiple schlerosis.
A guy taking money hand over fist from government programs but calling himself a “historian” is being “praised” outright for taking on the press for asking the same questions we would have derided them for had they not.
A fat, bloated, arrogant, racist, sexist, supercilious fake, replete with all the characterics most of us abhor, is being “cheered on” because of his phony excuses in the face of his past misdeeds simply because of the hatred for Obama that seems to trump commonsense.
Not sure whether I am as disgusted by this apparent lack of self awareness on the part of Newt Gingrich or the those who would support this man in the face of his numerous scandals based on nothing more than a loathing for Obama because it truly makes no sense.
Despicable? Yes, but no more so than those who seek pleasure in finding reasons to boost his profile knowing who and what Newt Gingrich really is.
There may be a host of “bad actors” in politics but no one stands out more so than Newt in this arena. You would be hard pressed to find a more egregious candidate running for POTUS than Gingrich.
I think the voters, whether R’s or Indies, have reached the tipping point in their disgust with the media. I find Fox News unwatchable, but I do go to conservative websites for info. The media has so jumped the shark over Obama, they’re about as popular as Congress. Even Charlie Rose has gone over to the dark side.
As a Democrat or former Democrat, your anger is misdirected. It’s unreasonable for you to expect the Republicans to nominate “a better Democrat” than the Democrats are running. There is no candidate in the Republican Party who would satisfy you because you’re not a Republican. You’re not even close to being an independent voter. If your fear is that true independents will look at Obama and Gingrich and decide that Gingrich is the better choice, then you need to make sure that doesn’t happen by giving us a better Democrat. There is nothing much about Gingrich that we don’t already know. Why is Obama any better? Give me and other independents reasons to vote for Obama instead of against whoever the Republicans nominate. The “What about the Supreme Court” and “Roe v. Wade” arguments have been all used up. Or work for a different Democrat to win the nomination if you can’t. Another alternative would be to join the Republican Party and work for them to put up candidates that are less egregious to you. But your rants are beginning to sound desperate and a little silly to people who do not subscribe to a tribe.
Really?
Or is it more a question of “Anybody But Obama” has you working overtime to justify voting for this man while stating the obvious.
Obama may not deserve a second term, but Newt has no business anywhere near the Oval Office.
Pass the popcorn! Newt is despicable. Karma is a bitch Newtie eh? If this takes him down, which I hope it does, he is getting his just desserts for what he did to the Big Dawg.
And I hope Callista is paying attention. If he did it to two others, he is going to do it to her too.
I agree. I am not cheering Newt on. The “audacity” of his “outrage” is simply astounding given what he did to Bill Clinton. The fact that not ONE media type is calling him out on that point alone is disgusting. The religious right giving him a standing ovation for being a serial adulterer is almost hysterical, if it weren’t so hypocritical and nauseating.
I think Callista knows all about Newtie. I believe they were having their affair before his second divorce and during the Clinton impeachment trial. Isn’t there some story about them getting caught in a car in D.C., with one of Newt’s young kids present?
I completely agree, imust. when I was listening to the radio last night, and then watched the clip on the teevee this morning (playing at every station near you again and again) the hypocrisy was tangible and made me want to put a brick through the screen. Both on the part of Newt and even more on the part of those “family values” chanting conservatives.
Yet at the same time, I couldn’t agree more with the message to the media. It was the messenger “what brought the message” that made it tough to swallow.
And the biggest Irony of the CNN debate last night is that it was sponsored by NOM, The National Organization for Marriage.
http://www.nationformarriage.org/site/c.omL2KeN0LzH/b.3836955/k.BEC6/Home.htm
NOM EXISTS to fight against Gay marriage and Gay civil rights including worker protections and gay adoption. These people even oppose domestic partner benefits, yet they ignore the hypocrisy of Newt and cheer him on as he feigns outrage over questions concerning his integrity and his behavior as a 57 year old man. Goddam, it’s not like Newt was a 20 something sowing his wild oats. He was a mature man, a U.S. Congressman and Speaker of the House during these issues of infidelity. The GOP/TP/NOM finger wagging about the sanctify of heterosexual marriage and the DANGER to marriage and society posed by TEH GAY is a hoax and exposed for what it is, BULLSHIT and HOMOPHOBIA dressed up in religion and piety.
But… but… but… he told the press off!
That’s enough to make him a “hero” and having the cajones for going up against Obama!
Forget his past. Rewrite his history. Whitewash his sins. Forgive his transgressions. Overlook his greed. Dismiss his lack of integrity. Rewind his moral compass.
He’s a “fabulous debater” don’t you know!
Obama just better watch out.
There is no way Newt will be — or should be — the GOP nominee.
yeah…he’s a dick…but after the first 5 minutes of the debate last night he may live to fight another day.
He will live to fight another day, Newt now leads Mitt in SC by 6 pts in the latest PPP poll.
Yep, Newt is soaring in the polls. The headlines should read:
“PIGS CAN FLY!”
LOL!!! Thanks PJ, that made my day.
PJ, that is soooo excellent!
Callista better keep lighting those altar candles, hoping and praying she never gets hit with a debilating illness.
That’s usually a “head’s up” that Newt may be moving on.
Amen.
When the hypocrisy rises to hip level you have to admit that the “shark has been jumped”.
Those who decry the press questioning Palin’s useless grasp of the issues while screaming about “sexism” are now standing and applauding a man who abandoned his wives in favor of whoever was sharing his bed at the moment, not to mention breaking those sacred marital vows they would deny gays, and are climbing onboard his train.
The same bastard who spent 18 months making Monica Lewinsky a household name while scolding Bill Clinton for misbehavior is now the “darling” of a portion of the electorate who would promote this man as a possible leader of the free world.
Getting kind of difficult to keep the memes straight when Newt Gingrich is offered exoneration in the face of the damage he has done to the nation.
But hey, he is just doing this for the country lest we forget.
“But hey, he is just doing this for the country lest we forget.”
Yeah, love of his country and hard work drove him to it.
And he was “appalled” that they would violate he sanctity of a presidential debate to bring it up!!! What a brass pair.
I’m still anxious to find out how much money the guy who recites lines from America the Beautiful has sitting in off-shore accounts, immune from taxation in American the Beuatiful. I wonder if Mitt knows that the author of America the Beautiful, Katherine Lee Bates, was a lesbian.
My favorite verse
O beautiful for glory-tale
Of liberating strife
When once and twice,
for man’s avail
Men lavished precious life!
America! America!
God shed his grace on thee
Till selfish gain no longer stain
The banner of the free!
Mitt, another Class A @sshole.
Living on the largesse of his “investments” but promising to take away any and all safety nets from the rest of us since he will never face the worry of where his next paycheck is coming from.
“Let the states sort it out” he says and the audience goes wild! Of course no one brings up the fact that state and local taxes will rise accordingly to just meet the salaries of first responders, nurses, and teachers. Something a governor of any state knows only too well.
Another problem he will never have to face since it will take 10 lifetmes to spend 250 million dollars.
Holy Cow! I was just talking about his today at work! Only I said, “likely Lesbian.”
Not only was she a lesbian, she changed the lyrics to make them less controversial and more mainstream. My favorite stanza was from the 1893 version of the poem. You want find that stanza in the current poem.
From Wiki: “Bates lived in Wellesley with Katharine Coman, who was a history and political economy teacher and founder of the Wellesley College school Economics department. The pair lived together for twenty-five years until Coman’s death in 1915. In 1922, Bates published Yellow Clover: A Book of Remembrance, a collection of poems written “to or about my Friend” Katharine Coman” “Some describe the couple as intimate lesbian partners,[5] citing as an example Bates’ 1891 letter to Coman: “It was never very possible to leave Wellesley [for good], because so many love-anchors held me there, and it seemed least of all possible when I had just found the long-desired way to your dearest heart…Of course I want to come to you, very much as I want to come to Heaven.”[6] Many contest the use of the term lesbian to describe such a platonic “Boston marriage”, typical of many professional women of their time. Writes one: “We cannot say with certainty what sexual connotations these relationships conveyed. We do know that these relationships were deeply intellectual; they fostered verbal and physical expressions of love.”
SophieCT..Sorry, I meant to write “Not only was she a lesbian, she was a social justice crusader. The orignal lyrics to America the Beautiful were considered a bit controversial, so she changed them to make them more mainstream
.
Much as I loved and respected Bill, it seems he was considered a ‘naughty boy’, and Newt is a monster..
Being handsome and charming garners a lot of forgiveness, doesn’t it?
Not that it matters, but Newt’s ex is behaving without class or dignity, I hope she got paid a lot.
Not on anyone’s side here, but moral hypocrisy seems to be all the rage these days, some things never go out of style.
There may be some degree of “moral equivalency” here.
Though Clinton may been a “naughty boy” Newt turned the entire thing into a circus for a period of 18 months, punishing the entire nation as he sought to pump up his ego as a presidential candidate even then. The “monstrous”part of the whole sordid episode is that we then came to learn that Callista was sharing his bed at that time while Marianne was stashed away in GA dealing with a fatal disease. Hypocrisy much?
Newt thought he was going to gain huge points in his efforts to rid us of Clinton but found, much to his chagrin, that the public was “just not into it”.
It wasn’t much later that Newt found himself at the receiving end of the same vendetta when he was brought up on his own ethic charges.
How many wives must he discard who suffer from some form of serious illness before moral outrage kicks in?
He is long past that due date.
“Not that it matters, but Newt’s ex is behaving without class or dignity, I hope she got paid a lot.”
Oh yeah, I would expect nothing less than making Newt’s ex-wife the villian, but FYI, Rush Limbaugh has already beat you to the punch. I don’t think that any of the parties to Newt’s sexual psycho-drama is a saint, but Newt is the only one in this psycho-drama who is running for POTUS.
“The “monstrous”part of the whole sordid episode is that we then came to learn that Callista was sharing his bed at that time while Marianne was stashed away in GA dealing with a fatal disease. Hypocrisy much?”
And during this whole sordid adventure Newt was the front man in the House for the Moral Majority. What a fucking joke!!!!
Actually, it was Marianne who was sharing his bed at that time while Jackie was stashed away in GA dealing with a non-fatal disease.
Let’s see: Jackie had breast cancer. Marianne has muscular sclerosis. Calista has flights of fancy.
Kind of hard to keep it with the wives, mistresses, and diseases that seem to inhabit this man’s orbit.
I am not blaming the victim, I am protesting moral ambiguity which is marching around the Web, with all flags waving. Most of us here would be appalled if Hill gave a similar interview, we also know she never would do so. When there are children involved, even if grown, the ex should consider them, she is embarrassing not just herself.
Frankly, I think Newt’s punishment is obvious…it’s Callista.
No, you are blaming the victim. Whatever reason you may claim, the result is the same. I doubt this will hurt Newt because conservative victimhood works so well with the usual suspects.
Sophie writes: “I am not blaming the victim, I am protesting moral ambiguity which is marching around the Web, with all flags waving. Most of us here would be appalled if Hill gave a similar interview, we also know she never would do so”
Sophie….How many wives did Bill Clinton run away from when they were sick and struggling with a serious illness? How many times has Bill Clinton taken up the banner of Moral Pontificator and used that banner to beat others over the head even as he was committing the acts he was condemning?
Sophie writes: “When there are children involved, even if grown, the ex should consider them, she is embarrassing not just herself.”
Boo-hoo!!! Newt was really concerned about his children, that’s why he left their sick mother. I don’t know why you defend Newt or continue to draw parallels between the actions of Newt & Bill or the behavior of Newt’s jilted wife and Hillary, but it’s not flying with most folks. You need to find an uninformed audience that has no memory of Newt, if you want a buyer for what you’re peddling..
“No, you are blaming the victim. Whatever reason you may claim, the result is the same. I doubt this will hurt Newt because conservative victimhood works so well with the usual suspects.”
Speak it!!!
Sorry Mouse, can’t jump in the playpen today ..Have to go walk dogs, who have honor, dignity and loyalty…and never judge others, until they are attacked. I was taught from the cradle to look at things differently, and not to judge, I don’t know is this is an asset or a detriment, but it’s too late to change. My knee just doesn’t jerk, but I fully support everyone’s right to use their knees as they see fit..
oh wait, I hear it coming… yes, I am revolted by the Obama’s but that is only after a lot of reading, and study Being willing to sell the country for thirty pieces of silver rises to a completely different level than personal perversions in my book.
“and never judge others, until they are attacked. I was taught from the cradle to look at things differently, and not to judge, I don’t know is this is an asset or a detriment, but it’s too late to change.”
Unless of course the “others” are poor or just not your cup of tea. The duplicity never ceases to amaze. Walk on!!
” I was taught from the cradle to look at things differently, and not to judge, I don’t know is this is an asset or a detriment, but it’s too late to change.”
Or if the “others” is one of Newt’s jilted ex-wives.
.
I think I just caught on to all the “Newt isn’t so bad, look what Clinton did” defense.
Palin is holding out for Newt and has encouraged SC voters to vote for him in order to lengthen the primary!
Of course, since Palin is in Newt’s corner so must everybody else who thinks she should be in the running.
This coming from the “family values, let’s bring integrity back to the country” former half term governor of Alaska who is able to overlook this sexist, racist, homophobic, three time married government lobbyist who “might find a place for her” in his administration.
My fault for not paying closer attention as to how anyone in their right mind could find Newt acceptable.
“Palin is holding out for Newt and has encouraged SC voters to vote for him in order to lengthen the primary”
So those are today’s marching orders from Sarah? Hmmmm, that SPLAINS a lot.
I don’t believe in miracles, but if I did this would make it into the top 10
Catholic Leaders Challenge Gingrich and Santorum on Divisive Rhetoric Around Race and Poverty
http://www.faithinpubliclife.org/newsroom/press/catholic-leaders-challenge-gingrich-and-santorum-on-divisive-rhetoric-around-race-and-poverty/
Now I’m duplicitous ? Does the name calling make you feel better ? If so have at it…Having spent the last half of my life with the very folks you claim such faux concern over, you sure don’t know much about the subject. The country is broke, how it got there, no longer matters, but Obama sure helped keep that ball rolling downhill..
The ‘poor’ fall into different categories, the truly disabled, disfigured, diseased, injured and mentally challenged… They deserve as much help as possible. Another group falls into the ‘poor choices’ group..that would be the drunk, doped, promiscuous, and violent.. they are a danger to themselves and others and need medication and/or counseling, and short term help. Another large group are the illegals, who siphon off a lot of aid that imo, should be going to citizens, ask any So. Californian about the tragedy of that situation..
Maybe a moment of respect should be given to all the families with children of their own, who scrape to pay their taxes to support all of the above..
Does this sound like duplicity or common sense, gathered from experience ?
Sophie writes: “Now I’m duplicitous ?”
Well, it’s looking that way. You made this comment up-thread “I was taught from the cradle to look at things differently, and not to judge, I don’t know is this is an asset or a detriment, but it’s too late to change” yet you spend an inordinate amount of time at this blog trying to convince others that most poor people receiving social services are slackers and fraudsters. Then you suggest that our countries financial distress is due to the slackers and fraudsters abusing the social services systems. So you write that you’re not judgemental, yet you constantly sit in judgment of the poor and use your education and your claim of experience working with the poor to legitimize that judgment, which makes you duplicitious.
Sophie writes: “Does the name calling make you feel better ?”
Does stereotyping and sitting in judgment of the poor make you feel better?
Sophie writes” “The ‘poor’ fall into different categories, the truly disabled, disfigured, diseased, injured and mentally challenged… They deserve as much help as possible. Another group falls into the ‘poor choices’ group..that would be the drunk, doped, promiscuous (goddam, sounds like Newt_, and violent.. they are a danger to themselves and others and need medication and/or counseling, and short term help. Another large group are the illegals, who siphon off a lot of aid that imo, should be going to citizens, ask any So. Californian about the tragedy of that situation
Are those your personal groupings & categories of poor people who are receiving social services, or is it a formal categorization that’s used by social service workers to decide who needs what and who gets what? .Just a rhetorical question because I know the answer.
So, any overlap in these categories? Are there “disabled, disfigured, diseased, injured and mentally challenged” people who have those conditions because they made “poor choices”. And how many of the “drunk, “doped” “promiscuous” and “violent” people have those issues because they are “disabled, disfigured, diseased, injured or mentally challenged”.
I’m sure there are folks who buy into this stuff you shovel out, but I’m not one of them.
Sophie writes: “Does this sound like duplicity or common sense, gathered from experience ?”
It sounds like what comes from the mouths of Sarah Palin and Rush Limbaugh and Rick Santorum and Michelle Bachmann and Ron Paul. Good luck with that!!!
So sell your worldly goods and take up a life of service..Our towns, states, and the Fed are broke, many folks will have to take up the Cause. You go first. You know everything there is to know, so have at it..!
“You go first. You know everything there is to know,”
No, that would be you, as you remind me regularly.
“So sell your worldly goods and take up a life of service”
LOL!!! My worldly goods are worth little. Everything I own is barely enough to feed and cloth myself, but your hyperbole is excellent. Still, my life is basically a life of service.
And you know the problem Sophie isn’t the poor, it isn’t me and it isn’t you. The top 1% owns nearly 35% of this nations wealth. 70% of this nations wealth is concentrated in the hands of the top 10%. The solution to the problem is glaringly obvious. Tax subsidies (better known as corporate welfare) must end. Those who take the most from this economy should return the most to this economy. No Cayman tax shelter. No tax codes loopholes that keep pushing the wealth up.
http://motherjones.com/politics/2011/02/income-inequality-in-america-chart-graph
At some point those who have funneled the lions share of big business profits to the corporate executives and board members must decide what sort of America they want.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/07/03/business/03pay.html?pagewanted=all
Face it Mouse, you are never going to change that mindset.
The hatred for Obama trumps any form of commonsense even if it means a Newt or Mittens presidency. Voting against one’s own interest may make little sense to you or me but for some it is the endgame.
The GOP could place Jerry Sandusky up for contention and they would find something “redeemable” about him to support.
The blindspot is to blame everything that is wrong with this country on Obama while overlooking that for a solid 8 years we had Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld and Rove demolishing the Constitution while lying their souls to hell. But who needs history when a “one term president” is the ultimate goal?
Obama has not done his job very well but the idea of replacing him with either one of these slugs is repulsive. These are the choices come November.
One can only hold out hope that somehow the inbalance in congress can be corrected and we may see more progressives booting out the Tea Partiers.
That’s all we have left.
Mouse, for once, I agree. The gov’t's coddling of Big Business is all tied to our system of lobbyists and campaign finance.. The fact remains that even people of modest means are ‘punished’ for playing by the rules.. We study, we work, we raise law abiding families, yet the gov’t feels entitled to any disposable income we have managed to acquire…After all, they have to fund the killing of people all over the world, somehow. In a twisted sort of way, even Obama isn’t the real problem.. The Real problem, imo, is that the Democrat party has simply given up on caring about ‘the folks.’ , and supports a system that allows this incompetent fraud to raise millions for a second term.. What used to be our party now has richer members than any in a Republican’s wet dream. Our party as we knew and supported it, no longer exists in any recognizable form. Only Big Dawg could have saved it, and he got his hat handed to him by Jesse Jackson in S.C. during the last campaign..The least racist president ever, including Obama, got pilloried for an innocent remark.. He’s too smart to let that happen again..So here we are, awash in political correctness, big business payoffs, corruption, and debt…what a country ! I did read somewhere, that Goldman Sachs gave ‘smaller’ bonuses recently, goody, gumdrop..
Pat, I can only add that if you had researched Obama thoroughly, you would hate him too..
Taking away any American’s right to due process, is just for starters. We need a real Democrat…but I think they are extinct.
Sophie, are you kidding? Pat’s awareness of Obama is not lacking at all. These InterTubes have at least 3 years of data proving that fact. You have totally misinterpreted her discussion about worse and worser.
Sophie, with all due respect, you have no idea of what you are talking about.
I have no use for Obama, never have, but that does not mitigate calling out the fools that expect to take his place. Dirty hands and false motives abound in all of these candidates, past and present.
Newt just happens to be the dirtiest of the lot. For many reasons, beginning with his treatment of women and carrying on until today when he promises to further enforce a ban on a women’s right ot choose. I expect even you can understand the danger in that proposition alone.
As for Mitt, there hasn’t been a more inauthentic candidate on the scenes than he. Can’t keep his facts straight, has changed positions so often even he can’t keep track. There’s no “there there” when it comes to Mitt.
So by comparison, as bad as Obama may be from a liberal Dem point of view, what are we getting in exchange? Poor candidates with agendas that are frightening since they are designed to unravel social programs that keep many of us from the poor house. Their insipid call to “bring back freedom” is based on shacking it even more so.
So please, don’t accuse me of not knowing about Obama, I figured him out in 2008 and he hasn’t disappointed. But to throw either one of these two losers into the mix and pretend they could do better is a falsehood. They can’t and they won’t.
And all the more worse for us.
Sorry Pat, I am not that familiar with anyone’s earlier posts. For a long time, the only sympathetic blog I knew about was “Hillary Is 44″
Newt is a lech, as a woman that bothers me..a lot.. But in my early life, I spent many years in a “Mad Men” setting, I got used to lech’s as one, I guess gets ‘used to’ living in a place with horrid weather . It’s just part of the landscape, as are men who think with their, er…hormones.. I have never understood why some women are attracted to such unattractive men, but power is sexy, I guess.
But that doesn’t change the fact that even the lech’s and ken dolls in the current crop, don’t seem to dislike and disrespect our country, as much as our current leader does.. So it’s, ‘do you want to jump or get pushed’..? Just like most other election years.
Pat, you won’t get most people here to vote for Obama. Are you going to vote for him?
I agree with you on Newt — I would vote for a third party candidate over him (I’d never vote for Obama). But, I disagree strongly on Romney — that he’s filthy rich is not a reason to think he’d make a worse prez than Obama. You seem to be stuck on his wealth.
NES…..Where you been?
Girl, you know Pat has said over and over again she won’t vote for Obama, but this shoe shining of Newt that Sophie is engaging in is frustrating.
Newt is the worse sort of hypocrite, I found a clip where he is pounding Bill Clinton as having no moral compass, while he was engaging in the same conduct. I know people change, but Newt was in his late 50′s during his tryst with the woman who became his 3rd wife. We both know the type, Screaming at the top of their lungs against equality in the law for gays until they’re caught in a bathroom stall or in the embrace of a gay hooker or propositioning a teenage boy on blog. Newt’s a bottom up and top down phoney.
As for Mitt, he’s the worst sort of silverspoon snob and as Jon Huntsman described “a perfectly lubricated weather vane” If he’s the nominee Team Obama will showcase that critque. It’s tough to believe that a man who wants to be POTUS would keep his booty in the Caymans, obviously to avoid paying U.S. taxes. I’m waiting for him to say “I didn’t write the law, I’m just taking advantage of the laws on the books and all the loopholes that go with it”. These things do not go down easy with average americans who pay taxes believing that those who seek to be. Governor, Senator or POTUS, are doing the same. You know what I mean?
I have no intentions of voting for Obama. Frankly, I live in a blue state and the chances are he will win it without my help.
What I am saying – or at least trying to convey without much success apparently – is that Obama may be that Pinto we would like to trade in but in place we are offered another “lemon” as a substitute.
None of these candidates are worthwhile. But what I find jarring is the assumption that the GOP is offering a better vision and that is simply not true.
Any party or individual who insists on shoving their religious beliefs into the mix, castigating gay rights, preventing women from controlling their own bodies, and refusing medical treatment to the sick, is not working in favor of the populace.
Deregulating industries in favor of some corporations bottom line is another danger that is being proposed under the fallacy of “job creation”. Lowering the tax rates even more on behalf of the wealthy while denying services and safety nets for everybody else is not a party I take seriously.
My issue is in others attempting to paint a picture of these candidates as people who will do a better job when it is clear that they are not working for us, the majority, but for those who will never be faced in a struggle to survive.
How many recall petitions across the country to remove governors whose positions are clearly in line with the present POTUS candidates does it take before we understand just where they wish to take us?
The only thing that really amazes me about the GOP primary, is that they have/had so many bad candidates. In a year when they should mop up, they’ll likely be defeated by BHO in the GE.
As far as programs to keep us from the poorhouse are concerned, Obie has shown over and over that he will throw anything and anyone under the bus, if it profits him to do so. He will read a poll, stick a wet finger in the wind, and cancel his own mother in laws SocSec, if it works to his advantage. He has already claimed to have written off the ‘white, middle class voters’, so our votes do not matter to him.. He has written off the Boomers, the largest voting bloc, a boneheaded maneuver that will cost him, because we Vote, no matter what. He is perilously close to losing a portion of the Jewish vote, and their money, as well. At least, if that special election in the Bronx is any indicator..So, imo, he is very dangerous to most social programs, and those who rely on them. He’s not a Democrat, he’s an authoritarian, I live in hope that his polls will be so bad, wiser heads will convince him to drop and take his hubris with him.
er..drop out, in last sentence… blabby fingers, again..
No argument from me that Obama could have done more – or less depending on your perspective –
But if we were really being honest with ourselves there is no reason on earth why Mitt Romney would be considered “the front runner” if his challengers had been anywhere near normal. He lucked out sharing a stage with Ron Paul, Michele Bachmann, Rick Perry, and Rick Santorum, all dedicated to shoving their radical right wing views down our throats.
But out of this lackluster pack emerged, for reasons beyond my comprehension, one of the meanest, dirtiest, most corrupt public figures to ever reach out for the title of POTUS: Newt Gingrich.
Are you seriously suggesting that the nation would be better served by this man? He wants power. That’s all he ever wanted. Not to serve the public at large but to serve an ego that has always been out of control.
Or Mitt Romney who wants the one thing he is capable of buying: the presidency which has nothing to do with public service but an act to satisfy the one thing yet he has been unable to reach.
These men have no intentions of serving the needs of the 65% of this nation who would prefer to keep Social Security safe, or to minister to the healthcare needs of millions who are without it. They intend on deregulating our food supplies, water, and the air we breathe all for the sake of industries who have had to be curbed along the way for their unsafe practices which brought the EPA into existence in the first place. This is dangerous and I would ask again how anyone could support these positions.
They want to control reproductive rights and banish gays from view. They see nothing wrong with racism as evidenced by their past statements. And this is what you are declaring is a better choice in 2012?
Again, Obama does not deserve a second term but to say that the proposed agenda thrown out their by the GOP is a better path is simply wrong. These are radical and surgical propositions that will do nothing for the nation but will increase the chances of us becoming even less able to compete that is if we don’t all die first from pollution, toxic water, and tainted food supplies.
Speaking of banishing gays from view, two male, and gay choir members of Rev Wright’s church were found mysteriously dead.. Both were ‘associates’ of BO’s..I think they might have preferred ‘banishment’ if asked, and it was rather rude that they were not at least asked.
I plan to vote for a can of tomato soup, even if tainted, it is healthier for me and mine than BO.
“Speaking of banishing gays from view, two male, and gay choir members of Rev Wright’s church were found mysteriously dead.. Both were ‘associates’ of BO’s..I think they might have preferred ‘banishment’ if asked, and it was rather rude that they were not at least asked.”
Yeah, we’ve all heard that story, along with the BC, born in Kenya, the fraudulent long form, the Secret Muslim, the Covert CIA Operative, the 20,000 SS numbers, the illegal student loans,etc. So what are you implying with this story Sophie? That Obama killed them or had them killed? This ranks right up there with the Bill and Hillary killed Vince Foster and sabotaged Ron Brown’s plane. Whatever drives your desperation at retelling these pathetic OLD stories probably needs treatment.
So much for your prediction huh?
Mouse, you never give up, I admire that. But you have never mentioned living in a big Northern or Midwestern city, like Chicago or NYC, where I lived most of my adult life.. Big City Machine politcs is legendary, in Chicago, it puts the mob to shame. Unsolved, and oddly coincidental murders are not as uncommon as they would be elsewhere. O didn’t kill his choir ‘friends’, he is too cowardly and doesn’t get his hands dirty..But that doesn’t make them any less dead.. Bo has some very nasty friends, what is so hard to understand here ? If I need treatment because I fear for our country, so do at least half the other citizens, at least I’ll have lots of company..
I think you tend to universalize your own experiences, which is normal as far as it goes, but one has to allow room for other perspectives…some of which are equally valid, but come from a completely different experience.
“I think you tend to universalize your own experiences, which is normal as far as it goes, but one has to allow room for other perspectives…some of which are equally valid, but come from a completely different experience.”
Sophie….I don’t live in a zip-lock-bag or in Bumfuck. I’ve lived a long time, been a lot of places. know a lot of people. Have family all over the country, I even have family in Europe. I had an uncle involved in the Mafia. I hate to break it to you but you don’t have to live in chicago or NY to understand a “hit” or to have experienced organized crime, gangs or corruption in government. Those issues are everywhere. Your experiences, your education, your former employment, your state of residence don’t make your life perspective superior. You’re truly a bit of a snob and you need to get over yourself
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You are the one who interjected ‘superior’, I still go with ‘different’… In 60 plus years, I’ve never been called ‘snobbish’.. wow, does that also mean I’m the dreaded ‘elite.?’ Cool……now if I only had their money…
Until you mentioned your work experiences, I thought you were a teacher. so there..