Update: If you didn’t watch it – find Condeleeza Rice’s speech online. And Gov. Martinez landed some serious blows as well.
No radio shows Wednesday and Thursday this week. To my surprise I find myself interested in watching the GOP convention. This has never happened in my adult life. Before 08 I could not be bothered with the GOP. Even 4 years ago I only watched Palin’s speech. For the record, I didn’t watch the Denver debacle either. I am almost certain I won’t be viewing the Democrats wingding next week. The TV Guide blurb is enough for me: Dems attempt 3 day remake of Triumph Of The Will. They fail.
Why an interest in the GOP convention this time? Hard to say. I can’t quite gut check it – but they seem more interesting than usual. The old white guy party had a surprising list of speakers last night. (Not that there’s anything wrong with being an old white guy, I am fast approaching that outcome.) There were plenty of old white guys trundling up to the podium to be sure. There was also an Indian-American female governor, a black female mayor from Utah (!), some youngish folks surnamed Valenzuela, Cruz, and Fortuño. If one turned off the sound at times it almost looked like a Berkeley freshman diversity indoctrination orientation. (Say that 6 times fast.)
Now not to contradict my own ranting about the poison of racial identity politics – but rather to reinforce what I have been saying for 2 years: Agree or not with their politics, the most interesting people are happening on the GOP side. Nearly all off them emerged out of the big GOP win in 2010.
I can’t think of one compelling political figure born of the 2008 Democratic wave, other than Obama – who, it turns out, isn’t very interesting at all. Early in Obama’s term I predicted that within 6 months the most popular, sought after Democrats would be Bill and Hillary Clinton. My timeline wasn’t off by much. I’ll take a small risk and predict now that next week President Clinton’s speech in prime time with get a higher Nielson than President Obama’s.
It’s not entirely evident yet, and I still don’t know who will win, but the Democrats are exhausted. This will become clear soon whether Obama wins or not. The back bench is the old guard, which is to say the Clintons. The hope for the future is 2 figures from the past, which is to say the Clintons.
Look at the possible contenders for 2016: Hillary Clinton, Andrew Cuomo, Joe Biden, Martin O’Malley. I can’t take anyone else seriously. Warren is possible if she wins but I see no reason to believe she could mount a national campaign. And she’d never sell with Clinton Democrats who will be ascendant again by then.
Clinton and Cuomo are serious people with political chops. Both are capable of running and winning. Clinton may well be done for good, and who can blame her? Biden is a delusional punchline. O’Malley will become a punchline, and is probably delusional. So that leaves Cuomo. If Clinton leaves the stage, Cuomo is it for 2016. Actually, if he can keep it in his pants, Gavin Newsome may be the most intriguing up and comer on the progressive side. I bet most here don’t even know who he is.
Now – if Obama wins – look at the GOP side: Ryan, Rubio, Martinez (providing she wins a 2nd term.), Christie, Ayotte, Daniels, Walker, Haley, Brown…even Love if she kicks some ass in the House. The governor of Puerto Rico might be the real deal as well, though accent probably makes him a nonstarter. That’s a farm team….AND racially diverse in a way that Dems try to legislate. I’M NOT SAYING I AGREE WITH ANY OF THESE POLITICIANS. I’m saying they are interesting. Worth watching.
Paul Ryan speaks tonight. If he sells the speech I feel safe in saying he is far more likely to be our political template for the next 10 years than Martin O’Malley. Even if Romney Ryan lose.
So I’m watching the GOP convention – DVRed 20 minutes behind schedule – the Santorums are still roaming free in the GOP after all. Fast Forward is always at the ready.
Wow. How about Condi? She could President. Watching her it feels like she wants to be. I mean I’m getting teary eyes like i used to watching Dem conventions. And – my personal New Mexico bias in tow- I love S. Martinez. I feel like I grew up with and still feel better whenever I see her – which is everywhere in NM (high school/college) and L.A. – adult life.
I’m totally with you, JWS.
i like gavin, i just wish the dems would start to feature the future dems and not throw them right into the presidency right away, aka obama…
i wish i could say i actually saw future dems out there, but nancy and harry have taken the wind out of any of their sails. it is like they are holding onto the old guard who are delusional and still are resentful towards the clintons, the only real democrats right now in my eyes. i feel like they (nancy, harry obama) can’t let go of some sort of what they think democrats should be, and yet they aren’t sincere about fighting for real democratic issues, they just give it lip service.
they are only sincere about blaming the republicans for everything. they won’t actually fight for gay rights for instance, they just use words and use these issues as a campaign issue every 2, 4 or 6 years. basically i just don’t see any authenticity in the democrats who they want to push up to the top right now or in 4 years unless they get hillary.
basically, if this is the same o’malley that was governor of maryland, o’malley was my governor. but i really don’t know what the heck he did for us. he didn’t stand out at all as my governor. he may just be a slacker like obama to try to climb that ladder to the presidency. that is a pretty lame way to get a candidate, to preplan it so many years ahead and not actually pick the person that fits that time when the time comes.
anyhoo, just some thoughts. i guess personally, i like rice, i see potential in martinez, and rubio. i love gavin, i just wish the dems would get behind him instead of running biden. i mean how lame does that sound. picking the person who was vice president just because he was vice president, but is a total goof ball is pretty lame. the dude may be funny and all, but he is just not a leader especially in these serious times economically.
Wow, Ryan is nailing it …nailing Obama’s presidency shut. Quite the superb orator.
Okay… also to lower my blogs standard – he’s really cute. Maybe I’ll just go F^@K it and vote on the cute factor.
Hahahahaha. That’s my guy. He is cute.
Ryan joined Mitt’s creed to his traditional one — one creed. Clever way to deal with the Mormon factor.
Also, quick glide over social/life issues. Again, clever.
“Let’s get this done!”.
Like “Let’s roll!”
Agree with all the above statements but would add my appreciation for John McCain’s passion for veterans and their issues. I wonder if they will be mentioned at all in Charlotte.
If there is one defining difference between Obama and the R ticket
it is in how O has trivialized the Office. Tonight we heard from people who still respect the Office and their fellow Americans or at least give that impression. It was an uplifting night, imo.
conner — don’t know if you are aware, Romney went to IN to speak to the vets:
http://www.npr.org/2012/08/30/160293862/romney-courts-veterans-at-american-legion-convention
If Obama were to win. Wouldn’t they have to run an AA in 16 else Chris Tingle would label them racists. Who would they run? Rangle??
Ryan started tentatively – ended strong. Also Rice – no telepromter. All her. Impressive.
What are the chances Obama attempts it
I just watched Condee’s speech, and I loved it. I guess I just really love watching real wit and intelligence on a stage. Tired of cliches and showmen. She impressed me. I kind of was hoping she would because of what I know about her and her road to secretary of state (and to becoming a republican when she was a democrat) and she exceeded my expectations.
I almost feel as if I don’t deserve to comment after reading the previous thread. But I wanted to second your statement that Obama has trivialized the Office. I wanted to say that when I arrived earlier, but the fur was flying and frankly, I’m such a wuss when it comes to arguing. (I’ve been caught in the middle for so much of my life.)
I made up my mind in 2008 to not vote Obama – ever. After watching the GOP last night and tonight – for the first time in my life – I am more willing to put my trust in this duo. At least the message is one that I can live with. As James Carville once said, “It’s the economy stupid.” I also think it’s our image throughout the world as well.
Obama only wanted the job to become wealthy, and reward his friends, he desperately wants to keep it for the same reason. Let me count the ways that is so wrong. .D.C. is not Chicago with better weather, why is that beyond his understanding ?
I am with you both. and I agree with Conner in that I wish ob would just retire and play golf and write books I will never read, so that we can have a real leader as our president so the world takes america seriously again.
Leslie, there is no “deserving” here. Speak your mind. Damn the torpedos…
Really, really liked Condi. Wow.
Ryan though — wow. What a disaster. The number of contradictions in that speech alone startles me. Universal health care is an evil handout, but it is the biblical duty for the strong to protect and care for the weak? Huh?
Nice little ‘protect marriage’ jab in there too.
Between Ryan’s dryness and Romney’s wooden quality, I’m afraid this ticket’s a damn fire hazard.
Though they would serve virtually none of my social concerns, I still think they’d be better for the country than the only other viable alternative.
Wow. What a stinker of a year for an independent.
Oh boy, Jay, we must’ve listened to Ryan in parallel universes — IMO, that was a masterful speech, in delivery and content.
I watched most of the speeches on a JetBlue flight.
CondRice gave a strong speech and I was very impressed with the fact that she did it teleprompterless. IMO she came across as more personable than she ever did as SOS.
I said to John that Iiked Huckabee’s speech as well, honestly I never really listened to him before or much of any republicans speeches for that matter… So maybe the novelty of it was what I was reacting to..and I loved the Bono name dropping…probably not as much as Bono did.
Ryan left me totally cold. He just doesn’t seem to have the juice IMO… He’s got a squeaky li kid voice, no gravitas and this saccharine kind of quality… He seems like someone’s kid brother rather than a vp candidate… He had some good lines, but blunted them in my opinion with inane comments like “let’s get this done” and stupid crap about his iPod? Aren’t we already on the tail end of a presidential term when that kindof stuff was trotted around? If the message is “the adults are in the room” Ryan didn’t come off as adult at all…IMO… Ryan is diminished in my eyes as a result of that speech.
I get that its really a rah rah fluff speech and it will excite the conservative base, but I think thats about all he did.
It’s all up to Mittens…
Dan, when you say “It’s all up to Mittens,” you’re not saying you’d vote for him if he somehow impressed you; right? So, why even imply you would?
I’m with you Dan, though the ‘disaster’ word that I chose above was too harsh. Major disappointment would be the more accurate description. I had hoped to resonate with him much more than I can.
After Condee’s speech, I really wish they would have taken a risk and picked her for vp over ryan who has this budget that some people just don’t agree with at all.
Condi Rice was an integral part of the Bush Administration’s failures. She will never be a viable candidate for Vice President or President because there’s way too much to sound-bite against her.
And I think it’s revealing, troubling, how easily some people are charmed out of recalling her role in what led to where we are today.
Agree that Condi isn’t viable as a candidate for POTUS or VPOTUS. Too much baggage from the Bush years.
Totally agree, Zal. Condi turns my stomach – part of the let’s go to war and kill people administration, and who cares how much it costs. Sort of like this one. Blech.
Really Senneth and Zal? Condi is a Republican war monger? I had NO idea! Next you’ll be telling me that she knew about the potential for a 9/11 and did nothing about it!
Zal, your snide comment about being ‘charmed’ is your typical, tiresome, Eeyore-esque, everyone-is-stupid-but-me bullshit. It was a good speech. It is true that her story, making it from a Jim Crow town in the south to Secretary of State, is remarkable, even if you don’t agree with her politics. It is not stupid to find a rousing speech rousing. It is also not ignorant to find a person whose politics you completely disdain to be an effective speaker. I find Condi’s level of accomplishment in her life, as a black person and a woman, inspirational.
Obama is a capable of a great speech, too, and he’s basically the anti-Christ.
Yeah yeah yeah, Jay.
Eva Duarte de Peron came from a severely oppressed and seemingly hopeless childhood and gave great speeches, too. Her drive and tenacity may be remarkable but her life story is not inspirational to anybody with a moral compass.
Achieving power has been, and will be, accomplished by a lot of people with backgrounds littered with hurdles. What sets apart the inspirational from the condemnable is what they do with that power.
Snark! Outrage! Shaking of fists!
Okay, it’s too hot here for me to keep this ball rolling.
Sorry, Jay. What you do with power also matters. Does Condi have an inspirational story? For some, yes. However, her incompetence as part of the last administration matters. I’ll never think an inspirational story trumps the consequences of one’s actions, and Condi’s actions (or incompetence) are writ large.
Hey, just to clarify up thread when I said it was all up to Mittens… I’m not voting for Romney, I just thought that Ryan’s speech didn’t change the atmosphere enough to sway undecideds and Romney would have to do the heavy lifting. I think it did but I’m not voting Romney or Obama regardless
…the thing about Paul Ryan is…not only is he “cute”, I would actually say handsome…but in addition, he is smart, earnest and he projects convictions…I thought his speech was great…he isn’t afraid to be forceful, but he doesn’t have that mean streak Obama and his crew have…this coming from a Clinton dem turned Clinton independent
…also regarding Paul Ryan starting tentatively, that may have been because of the protestors that started acting up and then were thrown out…you could also hear the crowd starting with the USA chant to drown the protestor out
Watched Condoleeza Rice and Paul Ryan. Impressions of what I saw and heard::
1. Very nervy of Rice to open with 9/11, “I can remember as if it were yesterday.” I remember, too. I remember the memos warning what was coming and I remember Rice saying “I don’t think anybody could have predicted that … they would try to use an airplane as a missile…” I remember Bush’s Iraq War, the cost in lives and dollars and so much else, and I remember Rice saying just this month, “Yeah it was worth it.” Nervy, to say the least.
2. She was using a teleprompter. She’s just a lot better at it than Obama. Watch closely and you can see her eyes consistently land and focus for a moment at the exact same place, left and right, left and right. Looking down at the podium, presumably at her speech, and out to the crowd, regularly, is the way a person who’s adept at using a teleprompter does it; it’s a magician’s trick, distracts from noticing the eyes go to the prompter every few sweeps to each side. She’s excellent at it, and as a speech deliverer deserves kudos for that, but she is using teleprompters.
3. Paul Ryan is trouble; if you’re dazzled by the superficial, that’s the intent, and you miss the Ayn Rand beast beneath his facade. Now, I loved listening to Ayn Rand, she was super smart and stubbornly self sufficient (though she shamelessly used and hurt people at her pleasure as she descended into depression), and The Fountainhead is a terrific novel, but dealing with the many elements of our economic crisis with an Ayn Rand ideology is a death sentence for the United States because it will be the final nail in the coffin of our middle class. If we go from where we are to where an Ayn Rand philosophy would take us, with Romney/Ryan’s way of lowering taxes for the rich, raising “fees” on the middle class and slashing the social safety net abruptly, our lower income and middle class will collapse. The Romneys and Ryans will be fine, which is all the Ayn Randian types care about; that’s okay for a novelist but it’s a disaster in a President at a time like this. Far as I’m concerned, as with Obama, people who are fooled by Ryan are people ripe to be fooled and deserve what they get — unfortunately, as with Obamabots, they take the rest of us down with them. He not even all that secretive about what he’s saying, it’s right there if you place what he says in context. For example he promises to cut the deficit by a huge amount. How? Romney has already made clear he intends to increase military spending. What big ticket items are left? Interest on our debt; can’t decrease that. What’s left after that? Social programs. And that’s why the social beliefs and agenda of Romney/Ryan matters. If you think social agenda doesn’t impact economic policy, today more than ever, you’re failing to recognize that the leg bone’s connected to the hip bone.
4. That USA! USA! chant is troubling at best. It’s the second time I’ve heard it at this GOP Convention and the extremist nationalism it reveals is another sign of the type of movements forming. Here’s the other USA! chant I heard; listen to it, watch the people, their body language and facial expressions. (The woman entering the stage is Zoraida Fonalledas, chairwoman of the Committee on Permanent Organization. She’s Puerto Rican. For those who don’t know: Puerto Rico is part of the USA.
From what I’ve read, the chants of “USA” had nothing to do with Fonalledas. Organizers had rushed her onto the stage in an attempt to keep things moving after the convention refused to seat Ron Paul’s Maine delegation. The angry Paul supporters were chanting “USA” in protest of their treatment before Fonalledas came on, and it continued after she was speaking. Now, it’s possible that others joined in the chant not really knowing what it was about, but it started as a Paul protest. Paul activists are also kicking around the idea of chanting “USA” to drown out and embarrass Mitt Romney during his speech.
Another point: Rice may be a good speaker, but I can’t believe the warm fuzzies that people all the sudden have for her. She is a war criminal! She was one of the top officials that lied us into attacking and occupying Iraq. She, Colin Powell, George Bush, Dick Cheney, and a few others should all be in prison, not being fawned over.
Condi Rice committed treason on 9/11. She should pay the full penalty for that.
The Fountainhead is a colossal mound of feces, one of the worst-written novels ever to be published. On the plus side, it did reveal the true depth of Alisa Rosenbaum’s psychopathy, and her hero-worship of a famous serial killer.
A Randian approach to the economy will lead us into a pre-Hobbsian state of War of all against All; lives nasty, brutish, and short.
I’m a bit concerned in general how so many here are falling under the sway of mellifluous demagoguery, while forgetting the content (or lack thereof) of the speeches. How many here also got tingles up their leg from obama the Deceiver’s 2004 convention speech pap?
Well, like NES, I read it in my mid-teen years so I’m in no position to defend it as adult reading. (I did try Atlas Shrugged three or four years ago and THAT is surely unreadable.)
But your second sentence is just golden.
Agree with Zal and Kim wholeheartedly about Rice.
Yes, Kim. Exactly.
Zal,
Thank you for pointing this out. Here’s a comment from the last thread I don’t think anyone read:
Senneth says:
August 29, 2012 at 6:42 pm
“The United States has collapsed economically, socially, politically, legally, constitutionally, and environmentally.”
“There are six million Americans whose only income is food stamps. That means that there are six million Americans who live on the streets or under bridges or in the homes of relatives or friends. Hard-hearted Republicans continue to rail at welfare…”
“Both political parties whore for money.”
“Mitt Romney and Paul Ryan want to cut or abolish every program that cushions poverty-stricken Americans from starvation and homelessness”
From the blog of Paul Craig Roberts, a conservative and assistant Secretary of Treasury under Ronald Reagan. I urge you all to read the entire article.
http://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2012/08/24/americas-descent-poverty-paul-craig-roberts/
Senneth, I am increasingly convinced that much of the poverty we see everywhere is linked to the failure of our educational system. There are far too many Americans with low skills and zero talent for becoming entrepreneurs … Entrepreneurship should be taught in high school and college, imo.. I believe it is something that can be learned, unlike say, a gift for music. Colleges who take tens of thousands in loan monies allowing students to major in ‘art history’ should be subject to fines. Also establishing high standards for elementary teachers should be automatic, and not open to discussion. Our public institutions must re-focus on the fact that they do not exist for the benefit of the employees, but for the betterment of the public..
sophie/conner, your response to Senneth doesn’t cover her comment, which is that Ryan has come up with a brutally cold hearted budget that would let these people s t a r v e. In America.
Also, not everyone is cut out for entrepreneurship. For my own part, I make an excellent employee, but have no desire to have my own business, which takes a huge amount of hours and energy out of every day. I admire those that do, but its not for most.
Altar boys like Ryan are the reason I and my Catholic school girlfriends became patrons of a gay bar ..Great looking guys who were good dancers, and no wrestling match afterwards, heavenly.
Altar boys think dancing counts towards foreplay.
Socal, I was responding to what I thought Senneth said, which was that the Ryan budget would bring dire consequences to many people. My point was that better education and training would help folks to make their own way. Entrepreneurship can be a fast track to financial solvency.
The key to either path is research, find a need or a want, and fill it. Clearly that is not for everyone, but doing one’s homework could also lead to a field where there Are jobs. Better, more focused, public education could really help with these issues.
Conner/Sophie,
While I agree that our educational system is rapidly becoming obsolete, getting an education in whatever field won’t help if all the jobs are gone. It used to be going into the sciences and maths would position a person to a bright future. After reading Riverdaughter and her layoff and the one hundred thousand chemists/researchers/etc. who were laid off in the pharmaceutical field, I’m no longer sure about that either.
Romney and Ryan spell disaster for the US. As does Zero. Unless we get out of this two-party paradigm we will continue to circle the drain until we actually go down it.
We are rapidly running out of resources and our consumption levels are obscene. Unless we elect someone like Jill Stein, nothing is going to change. I don’t buy the argument that she couldn’t get any cooperation or get anything done, because if the people elect her and pressure congress to work with her we will create a new paradigm.
Again, I cannot believe former Hillary supporters would work and vote for Romney/Ryan who will continue to gut much needed social safety net programs.
http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2012/08/obama-honored-fallen-seals-by-sending-their-parents-a-form-letter-signed-by-electric-pen/
The hubris never stops.
Cory Booker?
Zaldonis, you are a voice of reason around these parts.
Condoleeza Rice-really? The Soviet Union expert who blew off all the warnings about UBL?
As Puss n’Boots might say, “The Kool-Aid, she comes in many flavors, my friend.
I’m judging the speeches not the history of the people who made them. This may seem coldblooded but it’s a blog here…not a history lesson. Today’s topic was the RNC. I’ve done my time on the interwebs going after Condi and crew. The reason I started blogging was W Admin lies. One can know 2 things at once. Clinton ended up doing plenty I did not like and I can still note that his political skills are astounding.
Condi’s speech was solid, moving and interesting. This was unexpected. Also she made a forceful argument for her case: American engagement. I’m not judging the POV. I’m stating that she made a good speech. I ended up wondering if Romney made a mistake in not insisting she join the ticket.
For me, Ryan’s speech confirmed my original post about him. Earnestness is his asset and his problem. The camera is TOO kind to him. He’s 42, the camera makes him look 28. (If only we were all so lucky.) I ended up liking his speech by the mid point. His “in your face” medicare attacks are refreshing.
Whether or not he can get past his youthfulness, or make it an asset, remains to be seen.
He is Liz Lemon’s better looking agent.
What’s wrong with Ryan isn’t his youthfulness. I mean there is something unsettling about an adolescent-ish Wally Cleaver being Vice President of the United States rather than Vice President of his high school class, but that juvenile quality is fairly typical of post Boomer generations. That’s his primary strength, electorally speaking. (Biden will look like an icky old man next to him, which IMO is what he is anyway.)
What’s wrong with Ryan is, to put it a new way, he’s poorly educated and misinformed. What he’s learned through his experience is superficial and off kilter. According to this speech, for instance, he appears to believe that because his mother prospered in small business following his father’s death, everybody can do that. Well everybody can’t. Contrary to his generation’s insane belief, we are not all potential Frank Lloyd Wrights or Thomas Edisons or Steve Jobs or even successful small business owners. From one human being to the next there’s a wide range of potential from small to expansive, intellectually and physically; and one of the biggest problems with our economy today is that good work potential exists for only a narrow range of talents. This mind set of Ryan’s, which Romney shares, can do nothing at all for millions of people who need jobs and are stuck in a holding pattern. This is a huge problem that someone like Jill Stein addresses but neither Obama/Biden nor Romney/Ryan even recognize much less have any inkling how to solve.
“I’m judging the speeches not the history of the people who made them. This may seem coldblooded but it’s a blog here…not a history lesson.”
Thank you for saying that.
Well if you’re not considering the history of the person who opens her speech,
then you’re not really considering the content of the speech itself and the person giving it.
The events of 9/11 might have been prevented if she and her boss had been competent at their jobs. The war with Iraq wouldn’t have even happened if she and her boss had been competent at their jobs. The 2008 financial crisis might have been prevented if her boss had been competent at his job. And there she is, opening her speech by remembering those events as if she and her cohorts bear no responsibility at all for failures on their watch.
If she were referring to events during some other administration, fine, but I don’t see how one can separate the events she wrote into her speech from her participation in those events.
Zal, I must disagree with you on one specific point: The Fountainhead is unreadable.
Ha!
We disagree but suddenly I like you even more.
Rofl, JWS. That book was readable, but only at 16. Couldn’t read Rand as an adult.
Zal, you’re correct to point out that Ryan was definitely channeling Ayn Rand at one or two points in his speech.
Even the movie was a train-wreck.
Oh but I’m a sucker for Gary Cooper. And Patricia Neal ain’t chopped liver.
“Zal, you’re correct to point out that Ryan was definitely channeling Ayn Rand at one or two points in his speech.”
Well, that would explain all of the unnecessary pregnant pauses.
Rofl Jay.
Just a thought. This Ryan meme of Turnaround. We now have seen how many republicans speak who were formerly Dems? Condi, Artur Davis, and Martinez with the best line: “Damn, we’re Republicans!”
This is the first time I’ve watched the Republican convention *sober*. It is interesting to see the changes from 2004. Isn’t that partly due to Palin and her push for others who are saying ‘the status quo has got to go’?
Re: The Fountainhead movie, Kate Hepburn was quoted as saying Gary Cooper was the handsomest man she ever met..She had a point, but I still dislike the movie, even when I catch it on netflix.
anyway, all i know is that BO is not getting my vote. that guy has got to go, become a one termed president, or he will feel as if he did succeed, though he totally sucked as a leader. he will live obliviously thinking he is way better than he really is if he is given that 2nd turn, where as if he isn’t then maybe he will stop being delusional and realize what a failure of a president he was. although, with how narcissistic he is, he probably still won’t realize it
I think this is a laudibly honest comment and I believe you speak for a lot of people but you sure don’t speak for me. Enormous as Obama’s ego is, my concern is about something much larger than how he feels.
Prepare to rub your eyes. THIS from Fox News????
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/08/30/paul-ryans-speech-in-three-words/
If you click on the author’s name, Sally Kohn, you’ll find Obama-supportive articles including one where she opens, “Sure I’m a Democrat and want Obama to win re-election …”
But more fun (to me anyway) is what she wrote in this piece you link to. I only got to the first Ryan “lie” and she’s not only wrong, which I was going to find a link to prove, but the link she provides shows she’s wrong. Geesch I am so tired of stupid Americans.
What Sally Kohn wrote:
What her links reports:
That link doesn’t say the downgrade was a result of Republicans threatening to not raise the debt ceiling; it says the downgrade is because the White House and Congress, Democrats and Republicans, can’t get their fucking shit together.
The point of my comment, Zal, is the masthead. Fox?
I’m sorry, I thought my comment was more interesting.
Yes, she’s been posting pro-Obama articles at Fox’s site for two years. Fox is smarter than MSNBC and CNN, that’s why they have a bigger audience and bigger profit: they want traffic because that equals ad dollars, and they figured out that if a gooper doesn’t like what the rare contrary voice writes they’ll scroll past and click on what appeals. But Sally Kohn brings her own audience, and hits, as well. Obamacrats are not very bright.
Love your post, John. What I have thought too – the Dems are just simply tired. No new leadership. No new ideas. Sorry, but what worked for FDR to turn the economy around with a world war that eliminated any global competition for America for a generation or more just isn’t going to work today. And, these are the economic ideas the Dems are clinging to. The Republicans not only have fresh and diverse bench, but reform ideas worth listening too. (they are about much more right now than just cutting taxes, although that is a major tenet.)
I thought Ryan – as well as Condi (shocking to me, because I don’t like her personally) – were compelling. But, I learned a while ago that speeches mean nothing. With Obama, less than nothing. What has drawn me to this crop of republicans – particularly all the governors – is that they are DOING things. The right things for these times. They also are a new breed of politicians who appear to want these roles to accomplish stuff, not to try to just get the equivalent of lifetime appointments. They seem unfazed by the possibility of losing a political job if it means getting the job actually done. That – to me – is real change and real hope.
As a complete aside – the cranky, per usual post above complaining about people chanting “USA” made me laugh. Same way a lunatic rant by Mathews does. What are they supposed to chant “Canada”??
run_dmc,
What are the governors doing that are the right things for these times? I’m curious.
What I see in our future if the R party gets into office (ditto for zero) is the continued privatization of the commons, i.e. water facilities, wastewater treatment plants, parks.
Has anyone read The Shock Doctrine? I think we’re living this situation in our country.
Senneth, I read it and I agree with your assessment.
Thanks, SophieCT.
Walker, Kasich, Christie, Daniels, Jindal, Scott and Haley and Martinez are new but on the right track. Only one on Dem side is Cuomo.
I’d like to know just what makes Debbie Wasserman Schultz’s voice so “horrible” to Mike(Aw Shucks) Huckabee? Is it that she’s a woman or that she’s a Jew?
What a complete lout he is and it’s karmic justice that Awshucksabee has put all that weight back on.
Oh well, like Dr. Phil and his diet book, Huckabee sold enough copies to suckers to make a pile.
Talk about laughing and eating all the way to the bank.
Is because she’s an awful liar.
John, could you please make a blog rule that posters are NOTallowed to post under multiple names and personas? Many blogs have this rule and ban posters who break it. It is not only disingenuous, but undermines the integrity, fairness, and reasonableness of the discourse of the blog. Most of us here, the long time regulars anyway, have had the same screen names since 2008. Think of how ridiculous it is, to have one poster repeatedly lambasting someone they disagree with, using multiple names and in some cases, multiple personas, creating a false impression that there are many people here who agree with them. I realize that professional party hacks (rethugs & obots alike) will have ways of changing their IPLs or have multiple internet accounts, so that they could post under different names with different IPLs, but some that don’t could be easily catched by checking the IPL; and anyway, if you would post a sidebar, or add to the comments box, that you don’t allow this, it would go a long way towards controlling this thoroughly chicken-shit practice. I hope you can see the problems with this and thank you for your blog, time, and objectivity in all matters.
Hiya socal. Long time no see!
I dont get this whole troll obsession. I’m of the view that trolls exist in commenter’s minds in vastly greater numbers than they do in reality. No one here seems shy about expressing his/her opinion, so why would he/she need a disguise. Even if it’s to create the impression that a number of people hold the same view, who cares? It’s not like the numbers influence people here either.
Tell me how. Do I look at the IP numbers? I admit to not finding this to be a problem on most posts. Who is two people?
NES, you can’t be serious. You don’t think that one person ganging up on another using multiple posts under different names is not intimidating to the honest, more meek commenters? I have no problem saying what I think and neither do you, but that doesn’t mean there aren’t others who do. Secondly I don’t have a “troll obsession”. I call bullshit when I see it and its bullshit to see someone posting here under multiple names and pretending to be multiple people. Its dishonest, ridiculous, and it cheapens the whole site to have these kinds of games played. Didn’t that shit bother you when the obots did it to us on No Quarter back in ’08? They would keep coming back under different names and they would keep getting banned. Could it be you don’t see a problem becuz this person/s shares your viewpoint? I don’t want to think so. What possible reason could anyone have to post comments, on the same thread for christsakes, under different names? Seriously…what reason?
“Could it be you don’t see a problem becuz this person/s shares your viewpoint? I don’t want to think so.”
Then don’t think so. I think you know me better than that: I actually couldn’t give two figs who “shares [my] viewpoint.” I’m either right or I’m wrong (and the latter occurences are not negligible, mind you), but, in either case, I don’t count noses.
I said I didn’t think it was a problem because I’ve seen no evidence that it’s happening. Suspicions are not evidence. If it does occur, it doesn’t seem to happen with any frequency that should cause alarm. But, maybe I’m wrong about that. If people are trolling for the reasons Zal cited below, then it’s not OK.
NES, please read Zal’s comment again. You don’t see it, yet its someone who regularly holds court here and attacks the non R2 commenters. Her writing style is the same, so its pretty obvious. When Lola admits she also Anabelle and writes about it on her own blog, how is that not evidence? It didn’t used to occur here, now it does daily. As I said, I think these types of games demean and cheapen our threads. If you don’t agree, that’s that, no need for us to butt heads over it, but after the ridiculous bullshit yesterday, I decided to bring it up to John.
socalannie,
I agree. And I hated it happening at NQ. What a horrid time 2008 was.
Thats a good point. I’ve similarly wondered about a couple of posters with similar writing styles who attaches the pro-Romney and former Hillary supporters. The sword cuts both ways, unfortunately.
Personally, I don’t care whose name is on a comment that I don’t agree with, either in content or tone. I just scroll past them because I could never agree, no matter how relentless they might be in their attacks. Its politics in the blogosphere, I guess.
And yes, it’s beginning to feel a lot like 2008.
“Attacks”, not “attaches”. HATE autocorrect…….
Sure we do, John. He’s the straight Democratic politician Obama was too homophobic to be seen with.
Ha! Love it! Newsome is a long way off and who really knows if he’s for real. Brown needs to step down, then he’d need to beat the mayor of my fair-ish city (who’s in the mud this week in Tampa for some payoff…not sure what.) Both are possible. THEN Gov. Newsome would actually have to deal the CA’s issues somehow. The dem bench just ain’t pretty.
Gavin married my scariest ex-boss’ daughter. Being at the same conference table with the guy made me queasy — I can’t imagine thanksgiving dinner.
John– Rumor has it that Romney will devote a large part of his address tonight to “his faith.” so, finally, he’ll be outing himself as a Mormon. Good if he does — he should take charge of that narrative. I’m a bit skeptical though about whether he’ll be courageous and forthright (instead of mealy-mouthed) about it.
The religion roll-out so far has certainly been fascinating, if not deftly handled. On Tues., Ann Romney mentioned that she was an Episcopalian before she married Mitt. Yesterday, Ryan cleverly joined his “creed” (ie, Catholicism) to Romney’s “faith” and declared (without further explication) that they shared a common “creed.” All part of normalizing potentially our first Mormon POTUS. Now let’s see if Mitt can unveil without fumbling the ball.
NES: I’ve noticed that the Mormon roll out has been consistent this week. Huckabee hit it hard, Ryan hit it more softly. Ann Romney… etc. It’s interesting to watch. So far the roll out is smart. The point is to nullify any coming attacks. I suppose Romney has to do it politically. Though I think he’s already won the hardest audience – his own party. They chose him. Independents, the ones who count now, won’t decide based on his religion.
By far the MOST interesting religious thing about this election is that there is not one mainline protestant on either ticket. Has that ever happened before?
No, I don’t believe that’s happened before JWS. At least according to the press I’ve read on the subject.
Equally mind-bending is this: there isn’t a single protestant on SCOTUS.
It’s the Twiglight of the WASPS. (Die WASPerdammerung.)
John: More on the subject of Romney’s ‘coming out’ as a Mormon. It’s kinda like he’s gay, isn’t it? Everyone knows, but it’s still a ‘secret.’ His friends and allies are ok with it, but the evangelicals hate it. His opponents connive to use it against him. He has to say it’s part of him, but nevertheless it won’t influence the way he governs. You can trust him even though he’s Mormon. And so on and so forth. (You get the idea.)
Have I been banned?
NES:
Here’s how Lola/AnnaBelle explained it in her post where she boasted about being a troll [emphasis added by me]:
Dishonest and devious people investing this kind of time and effort into causing discord, creating multiple false identities and personas from access points all over the city for the thrill of feeding paranoia, wasting people’s time and raising blood pressure because it impacts the effectiveness of a blogger’s product (all of which you’ll find spelled out in her article) has serious mental health issues.
Ah, it’s the link to Lola’s article that I can’t post. Wonder why?
How interesting and illuminating, Zal. It’s so odd to me that anyone would find that a worthwile pursuit.
I find that kind of behavior despicable even before I read the Sunstein crap in there. Holy cow!
Thanks Zal. I truly appreciate that. I believe she’s posted here as Julie, Anonymous and other names as well. We’ve all enjoyed spirited discussions and arguments here over the years, but they’ve all been real and honest. This trolling thing is like an infection, totally demeans the threads.
100% agree with you, socalannie.
Watching the Dems p.r. machine, MSNBC, is sort of hilarious, if it weren’t so awful..Apparently all those dumb White millionaires are now honorary Blacks. In their view, every word not spoken by them is a racist slur. Tingles said that the word “Chicago” is now racist, in his view. He seems to want it called something else, like “that toddlin’ town.. ” Last night three of them argued with Scott Walker over something Obama said about a GM plant closing in Wis. He is on tape saying this, the three blind, deaf, mute monkeys argued that he never said it…unbelievable.
That slayer of racism, . Chrissie is having a nervous breakdown on the air, his three viewers pretend not to notice.
I feel the need to explain myself a wee bit: On the RNC I’m judging the political usefulness of the speeches, not backgrounding the speakers. Rice and Martinez gave good speeches. Rice’s will be remembered for a long while. Ryan’s speech felt off to me in the beginning but got much better. My take is that visually he reads very young. Politically it is a problem. The Ryan mockery will be images of him with a pacifier. I bet they are already out there.
Visuals matter. Some 42 year olds look 52 on camera. He looks 28. I am now keenly interested to see how a sober Biden “looks” next to him in a debate. Lloyd Bentsen squished Quayle in one line because of this dynamic. Quayle “won” but he never recovered. You can bet Biden will figure out to crystalize his youthfulness as crass inexperience. How Ryan reacts will matter. JFK used his youthfulness to hammer Nixon. Mostly by doing nothing more than sitting calmly. It helped that it was seen in black and white, which made Nixon look even worse.
No problem with others ripping people’s positions or history. I was commenting on how politics works in the TV age.
“I feel the need to explain myself a wee bit:….”
From my perspective, JWS, no explanation is needed. We share an addiction, namely, watching, analyzing and evaluating the ‘game’ of politics. An amoral and socially- worthless pursuit, I know, but delicious nevertheless.
” JFK used his youthfulness to hammer Nixon. Mostly by doing nothing more than sitting calmly. It helped that it was seen in black and white, which made Nixon look even worse. ”
**********
My sister and I talked about that debate a few weeks ago. She, a Dem, listened to the debate on the radio and though that Nixon hammered JFK. She was surprised that people who watched on TV had the opposite opinion.
way off track… I have been inundated with notifications of comments. Is there a way to stop the emails? Thanks.
Too late for now. Next time before you post your comment, unclick “Notify me of follow-up comments via email.”
Alternately, If you know how, you can set up an email folder and direct all emails from JWS to go into it.
Thanks tamerlane. I’ll try to figure out the folder thing. And in the future I’ll make certain I don’t check the box. again.
Jay, come sit wth me on the next thread. It’s cooler there: no snark, no outrage, no shaking of fists. We can watch the Romster together.
I’ll take a small risk and predict now that next week President Clinton’s speech in prime time with get a higher Nielsen than President Obama’s.
omg no one would take that bet…a frozen head of lettuce would out draw bammie at this point, much less President Clinton. Perhaps it would help if they appeared together, the way Cheney had to baby sit Bush 2 at the 9/11 commision??
I haven’t seen the convention…I only saw a photo of Christie with the caption, ” we are the truth tellers! ” and I knew what he said…here’s the GOP “truth” (and the current Dem truth as well. )
There is an endless tsunami of the public’s money for banks and corporations, just ask!
But for anything benefiting the public…. tighten that belt you greedy, undeserving sloth !
Banks and corporations : ” Take all you want, no wait , take more!”
John and Jane Q. public : ” What? Hell no we’re broke! “
Reflecting on the last three days, doesn’t it seem that the R Convention was mainly about nostalgia ?
As one who remembers those days, there are a few things I miss. Mainly having to do with less violence and crime, and people being way more polite.
However, whenever my children comment on how ‘cool’ life was in my day, I remind them about polio, mumps, measles, the Cold War, and don’t even start on opportunities for women and minorities..
No matter who wins the election, crime will continue to escalate and Emily Post will still be dead.
Romney is more likely to be taken seriously in the wider world, and may restore some hope for the economy.. Beyond that O is no different from any under-performing employee, in the world of business he would not have survived the probationary period.